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Aversion, Death, Rebirth, Vanity                        
 
AVERSION, DEATH, REBIRTH & VANITY

 
 
7. JACKIE DOBLE

 

Not much to say on the bio level. 

 

Only just recently enlightened, in the last couple of months, although it has been an on-going process for 20 years. And only became conscious that something was going on in the last 4 years. I followed a yoga tradition (Kashmir Shivaism) (or rather a teacher) who told me I had no chance of reaching enlightenment, so I ignored all the energy fizzing and vibrations going on in my body, until it became too intense (burning) to ignore, and I started to look for answers elsewhere. I first found Darpan (Swiss teacher) whose book (in French) described the exact sensations I was experiencing. Although the rest of his teaching was for people who have much more violent awakenings than mine (i.e. a lot of stuff to burn off). I have since moved onto Advaita teachers, notably Francis Lucille and Rupert Spira, both of whom helped me a lot. However, my realisation experience was much more 'in the body' through bodily sensations, than the Advaita approach, which does not recognise kundalini or tantra.

 
I am not teaching (except yoga) and certainly don't intend to do so for the near to medium term. I expect that the process will deepen over time. Right now, I feel I have nothing to teach. 

 

 

 

INTERVIEW

 

 
NDM: At the point of death and the breakup of the body, (see details here) but what happens to the mind?
 
Jackie Doble: I don't know. I'll tell you when I get there! However I am guessing what's left of the ego dies at that point.
I did a shamanic journey once a long time ago, to find out what happened when I died. What happened was that I shed myself of my physical body, and became just a point of energy (yet I was still myself). Then I travelled fair and wide until I merged with a cloud. In the cloud I was myself and yet part of everyone/thing in the cloud. We were all one, but separate. There was also a huge overpowering feeling of immense, vast love. This experience was the start of my spiritual journey. I have since discovered that other people (including Robert Monroe - Journeys out of the body) have come across the same cloud through out of body journeys. This was not the ultimate experience of unity as it appears to be a place. I have no idea what is was. But it was pretty good for a taster.

NDM: Is rebirth into a heaven, hell, human, animal, spirit, hungry ghost realm a reality?
 
Jackie Doble: If you are not realized, I think you move into the post-death reality that is in line with your beliefs, and what you think you deserve. That's supposing you have spotted that you are dead! I have had a lot of issues with spirits hanging around me in the lead up to the realization, some not very nice ones. I had to move them through to the light, even get them to transform into pure energy and love. I guess that was part of my path. As a young girl I was terrified of the concept of ghosts.
 
I hadn’t spotted the human bit – I just stopped at heaven and hell…then skipped to ghosts! so. here goes:
 
NDM: What about karma? What roles does that have in rebirth?
 
Jackie Doble: I think it has a big role to play – I know some teachers say it doesn’t exist. My observation of myself, my only point of reference, suggests that it does. Issues not resolved (or rather to which you hold an attachment) come back in future lives. Lose attachment to these issues, in other words, become detached, stop identifying yourself with the specific ego, or soul, and you will become realized. The way to become detached is not to fight and try and resolve the issue but to surrender to it. To get rid of my fear about ghosts, I had find a way to surrender to it. It took a long time, as it was deep seated, since my childhood.
 
NDM: Is not identifying or being detached enough, or do you need to stop taking certain types of actions as well?

Jackie Doble: Surrendering to the unknown is everything. It's also the most difficult to do. Fear of the unknown is behind almost every problem in the human condition.  
 
NDM: Does an enlightened person fear aging, sickness and death?
 
Jackie Doble: No absolutely not. I just went through this experience, as I found a lump in my armpit. Everyone was telling me I should be worried. I couldn't get worried at all. I eventually sat down to meditate on the possibility of dying. I laughed. I was full of joy. By the way, it turned out to be nothing ;-)
NDM: Would an enlightened person wear seductive clothing, makeup, have plastic surgery, (implants, Botox, liposuction), or even color their hair to appear younger, more attractive for their self esteem, or to attract followers, disciples/clients?
 
Jackie Doble: I spotted that Eckhart Tolle dyes his hair. I don't know why he does that. I do believe he is fully realised. Maybe it just gives him pleasure. I certainly don't dye my hair and have no intention to do so. It doesn't interest me. However, there is a case for dressing well I believe in front of disciples/clients. Because if you are dressed like a tramp, the people will focus on that (i.e. you are pushing their buttons about dress codes) and therefore they will not focus on the teaching. I certainly dress up when I go to important meetings, etc.
 
NDM: If ET or anyone else like him is fully realized, then why would they be so concerned with their looks?
 
Jackie Doble: We have entered the world of pure speculation here, which neither you or I can answer! All I know is if we look back at other realized masters, many of them have had far worse problems: Krishnamurti had an affair with his best friends wife for years, then in later years sued him (though not over his wife); Swami Prajnapad told his (French) disciples that he knew about yoga postures, and when pushed for further details, demonstrated clearly that he knew nothing at all, so he was lying. They all have their foibles. In the West, we tend to equate realized being with ‘saint’ expecting them to behave impeccably without taking a step out of the mold of perfection. That is our Christian culture, but it does not necessarily apply to reality. A quick reading of tantra or other stories in the yoga tradition and you will find tons of enlightened masters who apparently are very far from perfection. I certainly don’t feel saintly. (and I don’t put myself anywhere near the level of any of these masters.) For milder issues such as colouring hair, you are suggesting that once someone is realized they should take no further interest in the personal appearance. Or rather you are suggesting that he is taking care of his personal appearance IN ORDER TO attract clients. I think the link is entirely spurious. Krishnamurti took great care of his personal appearance, dressing in expensive clothes. He just liked expensive clothes. Apparently ET likes having his hair brown and not gray. But I don’t think you can read any ulterior motive into that. What’s important is does his teaching resonate with you and with others? If that is the case, then who cares what he looks like? And if it doesn’t resonate, then he is not the teacher for you. Find someone else.
 
NDM: Would an enlightened person take sleeping pills, drink alcohol, take recreational drugs (smoke marijuana, LSD), or medication for mood control, anxiety, depression (Prozac, or Viagra)?
 
Jackie Doble: No way. Although I will sometimes drink a glass of wine in a social setting. Except that it’s difficult for me to digest alcohol without getting an instant migraine, so those occasions are getting fewer and farer between. Also what mood control, anxiety, depression? There are no mood swings once you are realised. That's the whole point!

NDM: Would an enlightened person have an aversion to harsh or desolate living conditions, isolation, desert, jungle, forest, (excessively cold or hot weather climates), fear of wild animals, snakes, scorpions, bears, tigers, crocodiles, sharks and spiders?
 
Jackie Doble: I can't see why we would deliberately put ourselves in the way of snakes and scorpions, bears and tigers. That smacks of bear-assisted suicide! But if we do get bitten by a scorpion - see question about death!
 
As for harsh environments. This specific body isn't fitted out for cold climates. It avoids them. But it's got more to do with physiological problems than anything in my psyche. I'd love to live in a jungle or a forest though. Show me the way!!! No problem with the desert either. It's all down to the fact that this body is a heat seeking missile. So yes, for physiological reasons, I would avoid cold environments if I could. But if that were not possible, I would accept it, ultimately its not important, just uncomfortable! Swami Prajnapad said very wisely: “anywhere is a good place to live”.
 
NDM: Can an enlightened person lose their temper, use foul language, or harsh speech, sarcasm, ridicule, make off color jokes?
 
Jackie Doble: I have heard that certain spiritual masters do, including apparently Ramana Mahairishi. That is not my personal experience. The sense of peace is so intense, that no reaction is possible for me. It's like someone took all the stuffing out of me. I have nothing to react  with.  

 NDM: Would an enlightened person make a legal disclaimer for their teachings, as to not be held responsible? (Please see example below).
 
Jackie Doble: Why not? If an enlightened person lives through donations, they do not want those donations to be used fighting legal battles. Personally, however I am not sure I would use them. But that's probably because I live in France, and people are much less likely to take you to court than in the UK/US.

NDM: What if they charge? Does this change anything at all?
 
Jackie Doble:  I really don’t know much about this, and it doesn’t interest me. I don’t see what you are driving at. Perhaps it's a US issue for US citizens.

 

 

Example of a Non-dual Disclaimer
 
Here’s some small-print legal stuff that we are obliged to tell you – it’s for your protection as well as ours.

 

By using this website, purchasing or attending a one-to-one session, attending a meeting, satsang, or non dual retreat or otherwise engaging with (so and so), you acknowledge that you have read, comprehended and fully agreed with the following disclaimer.
 
This website is for general information and entertainment purposes only. Use of this website, or attending a meeting, non dual retreat or one-to-one non dual session with ( so and so ), or having an email dialogue with him, is NOT a replacement for or substitute to face-to-face, in-person, qualified medical, psychological, psychiatric or legal advice, diagnosis or treatment. ( So and so ) is not a medical doctor nor a licensed psychotherapist. ( So and so) does not diagnose, cure, heal, or treat disease or psychological conditions or otherwise prescribe any kind of medication whatsoever.
 
If you think you are suffering from a medical or psychological disorder or condition, please consult your doctor or other appropriately qualified professional person or service immediately. You are invited to consult your doctor and/or therapist about one-to-ones sessions, meetings or retreats with ( so and so) in order to make an educated and informed decision as to whether or not they are right for you. IF YOU ARE CONSIDERING OR CONTEMPLATING SUICIDE OR FEEL THAT YOU MAY BE A DANGER TO YOURSELF OR OTHERS, PLEASE NOTIFY THE POLICE OR CONTACT YOUR LOCAL EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES IMMEDIATELY. Never, ever disregard professional advice or delay seeking professional advice as a result of something you have read on this site or from anything that ( so and so ) says or writes to you. ( so and so ) shall not be liable for claims or damages, and expressly disclaims any and all liability of any nature, for any action, or non-action, taken as a result of his one-to-one sessions, meetings or retreats.
 
The word “non dual counselling” here is not used as a medical term, but simply describes an in-depth, honest, exploratory, private and confidential conversation. Sessions with ( so and so ) may be considered “spiritual” or non dual in nature rather then therapeutic or prescriptive. A one-to-one non dual session, meeting or retreat is intended and designed to be informational and educational for you, and provide information, support and encouragement based on information what you choose to share with ( so and so). You are fully and solely responsible for all information that you provide to (so and so), for your interpretation of ( So and so') words and actions, and for all actions resulting from or relating to your encounter with (so and so)
 
(so and so) does not guarantee or warrant any particular outcome or result from your non dual session, meeting or retreat, or other kind of encounter, with him, and makes no claims as to the effectiveness of the sessions.
 
Using ( so and so) services is entirely at your own risk without warranty of any kind, either expressed or implied, including without limitation any warranty for information given, advice, or opinion. The services are requested by your own choice and with your inherent singular responsibility.

 

Thank you for your understanding.
 
End of disclaimer.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 END OF INTERVIEW