NDM: Did you study kundalini yoga mostly in India or any
other path?
Brigitte: I never studied Kundalini
Yoga. I had a spontaneous Awakening/Self-Realization
when I was 32 years old. I had never heard of Kundalini
and knew nothing about it or Self-Realization.
After the Awakening, I searched for answers as to what happened
and why. What I know and came to understand, is due to
a 30 years search and for being my own laboratory. I
studied with many religions and practices but never
belonged to any.
Are you specifically interested in Kundalini?
NDM: Not specifically but it does interest me.
Brigitte:
It resides in all of us and is active to varying degrees
in everyone.
NDM:
Yes, when you say that you came to an
understanding. What would you say this understanding is?
Brigitte: I realized that we are Immortal Beings. That there is
no death. That this terrestrial realm is very real
while in it, but that it is only an illusion!
I know why we are here and where we are going. That it is our
Soul who we communicate with. Who watches over us and
gives us guidance and comfort.
That we are LOVED and accepted, unconditionally.
That there is no god.
That there is only the DIVINE OCEAN OF CONSCIOUSNESS, and we are
the waves within it.
That we are Beings in the making.
That we are not our ego, our personality, our body or our Mind
That the most important quality is LOVE.
NDM: What is this soul exactly that communicates and
watches over us?
Brigitte: During
our stay in a physical body, we are composed of three
separate components: a lower self, a Higher Self and the
Immortal connection with our Soul.
Our lower self which is our personality is mortal. It
is birthed and dies in matter. The next step in our
evolutionary journey is to evolve into the consciousness
of our Higher Self. The Higher Self is both mortal and
immortal, because it has access to the realm of the
lower self and to the realm of the Soul. The Higher Self
consciousness is the intermediary between matter and the
Transcendent. The eventual goal is to reunite with our
Soul. The Soul is who we really are.
Our Soul cannot leave the Transcendent Realm, it can’t
come down into the mortal world of duality, matter,
space and time, for it has no physical body.
Indirectly, the Soul experiences life in matter by
sharing the experiences of its lower self and Higher
Self, who it has sent down into matter. It is through
their experiences and their growth of essence, that our
Soul continues to evolve.
Our Soul is always connected and in touch with us,
because our Beingness is grounded in our Soul’s
Immortality. But, it is only after we have woken to our
Higher Self Consciousness, that we become aware of our
Soul’s presence.
We are actually in contact with our Soul, not with a
“god”. Our Soul is the intermediary between us and the
Divine Creator. We have no direct contact with the
Divine Creator. It is our Soul who we have a personal
relationship with. We are an integral part of our Soul
with whom we have our most intimate union. We are the
same as our Soul, who is
our Beloved and at the
same time we are the Soul’s most dearly loved. Our Soul
is closer to us and knows us better, then we know our
self.
It’s our Soul that hears and responds to our
calls and hears all our aspirations. It is our Soul
that watches over us and guides us on the path of our
spiritual evolutionary journey. It is our Soul that
sends us all that we need. Not always what we want, but
what we
need!
It can be said that the Divine Consciousness is the
ocean, the Soul the waves, and we and all other physical
life forms, have our physical existence within the
various depths of this ocean.
NDM: So when you refer to the soul. Are you speaking of the
Jiva and all the things
that bind to it like karma and samskaras, or the
Atman?
Brigitte: When
I am speaking of Soul, as I define it, I speak of the
Atman. The Soul is pure and has no Karma. It is not in
touch with matter, time or duality. The Soul is a spark
of the Divine Consciousness, the Divine Creator. Just
as the Jiva is a spark of the Soul. It is the Jiva,
that defines the lower self and the Higher Self of which
I speak. It is the lower self and the Higher Self that
are under the law of Karma. One can only be under the
law of Karma when one is in a physical body and subject
to the laws of time and duality.
John, I prefer not to use Sanskrit terms and use them
rarely in my writings. These terms belong to the past,
to a different consciousness. The consciousness of the
New Man is of the NOW. The New Man, requires a different
language when defining his spirituality. He requires
more direct and personal terms. Because, the New Man has
a personal and intimate relationship with his Soul.
Unlike the old man, he needs no go-between, such as a
priest or religious organization to have a connection
with his Soul. The New Man of the Higher Self
Consciousness is Aware and Awake to his Soul and knows
that he is, in Reality, that Soul. He is aware, that
while in the physical body, he is just a shadow, a
mortal personality, sent down into matter to experience
the life of the physical senses. Through this, he and
consequently his Soul, attain to more essence. Essence
is food for the Soul.
NDM: So how does one attain this
higher
consciousness. What if I wanted to do this. Do
you have a method for showing me, how I could do this?
Brigitte:
No,
I do not have a method for anyone else. As I said
before, each person’s inner journey is unique. The most
that I can do is to ‘point the way’ and to give hope and
encouragement to those who are trying to grow into a
Higher Consciousness. That is why I am writing about my
experiences.
What is necessary for attaining to a Higher
consciousness, is the hunger to leave the lower self
consciousness and all that it contains. It us this
unnamed hunger that you feel, that spurs you on to
reunite with your Soul. And we can only reunite after we
attain to the Higher Consciousness.
One must have a sincere ‘do or die’ aspiration, to do
so. One must be willing to leave behind the ego and to
surrender to our Soul’s call. The Soul is always
calling us, but most of us do not hear this call. We
must empty the mind as much as possible. When we come
to those moments when our Mind is stilled, then the
Soul’s call can come through.
It is our Soul that make it possible for us attain to a
Higher Consciousness. Your Soul wants you to come
nearer to it and it will make everything possible, for
you to attain to this Higher Consciousness. The Soul
alone knows, when your time to do so is ripe. And when
that time comes, it will happen. In the meantime, you
must keep your aspiration for freedom, alive and
active. And you must have faith, that all that happens
to you, is in your best interest. And whatever occurs to
you, occurs in order to bring you into the Light of your
Higher Self Consciousness.
The attainment of a Higher Consciousness, will occur
through Self-Realization and Self-Realization is brought
about by an awakened and risen Kundalini. This whole
process is often brought about spontaneously by the gift
of Grace.
It is Self-Realization that will open the seed of the
Higher Self, a seed that is already within you. Growing
into Higher Consciousness will be a step by step
process. There are many stages, many various depths of
Higher Consciousness. One Self-Realized, you will
become an aware partner, an intermediary between your
lower self and your Soul, for continues growth of your
Higher Self.
NDM: Which religions did you study?
Brigitte: First, I will say that I was fortunate enough never to
have been indoctrinated to any religion. Therefore, my
mind was open to all.
My mother was Jewish and my grandmother was a Lutheran.
I studied the major Western religions and for some time studied
directly with The Jehovah's Witnesses. I often went to
Catholic churches to attend services. All my childhood
friends where Catholics and I was very much drawn to the
Catholic rites and the old cathedrals. My teachers in
grade school where nuns.
I had a family member who was a Baptist and often attended church
with him.
I was an active member with a Gurdjieff Work group for almost 5
years.
I stayed in several Ashrams for months and studied Sikhism.
I studied and participated in the rites of Hinduism, in all its
many forms, for 8 years, while living in Rishikesh,
India .
I studied and practiced Sufism.
I followed the practices of the Integral Yoga of Shri Aurobindo
and The Mother.
I followed the philosophy of Dr. Paul Brunton and Franklin Merrel-Wolff
I follow the way of Tantra.
Above
all, I follow the guidance of my Soul.
NDM; Would you say that self realization, attaining higher
consciousness, enlightenment is an experience?
Brigitte:
Yes, I would say that at the time of the
Self-Realization or enlightenment process, it is
an experience. After the initial experience, you can no
longer call it an experience, for it is now a part of
your DNA.
I would also, during the process of moving
into a Higher Consciousness, call that an experience.
However, once you have permanently attained to that
Consciousness, it is no longer an experience. Once you
are that Consciousness, you are no longer watching it,
or are aware of it. For you are That. And when you are
That, there is no gap between, That and you. And when
there is no gap between the two, there is no separation
to watch and experience from.
NDM: When you say that "unlike the old man, he
needs no go-between, such as a priest or religious
organization to have a connection with his Soul". What
about guidance, if a person gets lost in this. Wouldn't
someone who has already gone through this be helpful?
Brigitte:
Yes, of course, they would be able to give guidance.
The New Man must also go through the stages of infancy,
adolescence, young adulthood etc., with each stage
having its own dangers to overcome. A guide can point out what the pitfalls of these various stages are and
how best to avoid them, or if one has already become
trapped, how best to find one’s way out.
Each one’s journey is unique, but there is a road map in
place with common critical turning points, that everyone
must pass through. Guidance can be given by ascertaining
where the traveler is on the roadmap. He can then be
assured that he is going in the right direction and what
he is likely encounter next.
For those who are in an isolated situation; by that I
mean, those who are making their journey entirely alone,
in a hostile environment, it is of great importance to
the traveler, that he can speak to someone whom he can
trust. Who will listen to him without making judgments
or to think that he has gone ‘off the deep end’. A
guide can validate the travelers experiences. This will
give
renewed hope and energy to the
traveler to persevere.
The guide can be a ‘home port’ for the traveler. A
place of psychological safety, when the traveler finds
that his old world has shifted and is no longer stable.
He feels adrift and knows not where he is heading. He
find himself suspended, in a no-man-land, with one
unsteady foot in the old world and the other floating
adrift in unknown territory.
NDM: What is this Divine Creator exactly?
Brigitte:
The Divine Creator is CONSCIOUSNESS. The DIVINE
CONSCIOUSNESS contains all that IS. IT IS, all that IS.
The DIVINE CREATOR, is the FULLNESS, which contains all
possibilities. There is nothing beyond CONSCIOUSNESS.
Even the beyond, is within CONSCIOUSNESS. The DIVINE
CONSCIOUSNESS, is the TRANSCENDENT ONENESS of LIGHT.
This is who most would refer to as “God”. But the Divine
Creator is not a personal “God”. The DIVINE CREATOR has
no personal form, for he is all forms. We do not have
an individual or personal relationship with the DIVINE
CONSCIOUSNESS CREATOR. The Soul communicates directly
with the DIVINE CREATOR, we, the personality do not. The
personality communicates with the Soul. It would be more
accurate to say when people pray to their “god”, they
are actually in touch with the Soul. The DIVINE CREATOR
does not sit in judgment of Mankind nor dispenses
rewards or retributions. It is through the laws, which
the DIVINE CONSCIOUSNESS created, that justice is
distributed.
NDM: What are your thoughts on Sri
Aurobindos intermediate zone?
Brigitte:
What are my thoughts? Not sure what you mean by that. I
can only tell you that the intermediate zone, when you
find yourself there, is breath taking in its scope and
the super-heightened realities that one encounters
there. One can go there while wide-awake, or during
sleep.
There are many realms there
that can seduce one into wanting to return again and
again.
And many become addicted and then trapped, such as in
the mystic realm. The mystic realm -- I call it the
honeymoon stage -- is so enticing and in its own way
quite erotic. Many become trapped in this stage,
thinking that they have ‘arrived’. But one has not
arrived at the final destination; this is just one of
the stages along the way.
Until one eventually overcomes the addiction, all
further evolutionary growth is stopped.
I have written on some of the realities that I have
encountered, in my book. I will relate just a few to
you.
Most of my travels there, were unexpected and happened
during my waking hours. Usually, while I was doing
ordinary daily chores. Several times I was ‘swept up’
while amongst people. I would loose almost, all sense of
my body and the surroundings I was in.
I found myself in the realm of mathematical formulas,
and saw that everything in duality was composed of
mathematical formulas. Once I was ‘swept up’ while I
was doing laundry in a laundry mat. I found myself
engulfed by knowledge. Wave after wave of knowledge
flooded my awareness. Knowledge so profound, that it
was like sensuous ambrosia. I tried to hold on to some
of that knowledge but it went ‘through me’ so fast, I
could not latch onto it for further absorption. All
this occurred, while I went in and out of awareness of
the laundry mat and my body.
Some visits to the intermediate zone occurred while sound asleep
in bed. I would suddenly become aware that I was
“awake” in a vision. I had many such lucid visions.
NDM: Would you say that divine consciousness is an
experience or a permanent state one is always in?
Brigitte:
The Divine Consciousness is not an experience, unless
you call Life an experience. We are an integral part of
the Divine Consciousness, therefore we are the Divine
Consciousness.
The Divine Consciousness is our immortal state. A state
without birth or death. So whether we are ‘alive’ or
considered to be ‘dead’ we are always in it.
NDM: What is the final destination?
Brigitte:
There is no final!
NDM; When you said earlier that we are "DIVINE
OCEAN OF CONSCIOUSNESS, and we are the waves within it."
What is this ocean of consciousness made out of?
The DIVINE OCEAN OF CONSCIOUSNESS is a pulsating force
of creative power. It is a self-perpetuating energy
force. This force pulsates in wave like movements.
These waves are fluid and each wave merges to varying
degrees into the outer fringes of the other. There are
no rigid boundary lines that define the partition
between each wave. There are limits to the waves
encroachments of each other and these limits are the
varying vibrational speeds of each wave. Each wave is a
different realm of consciousness.
There are endless differing states of consciousness with
the DIVINE CREATOR CONSCIOUSNESS. Each consciousness is
a realm that is composed and supported by its own unique
vibrational force and influence. And it is these unique
frequencies that create the vibrational barriers that
exist between each wave.
The DIVINE OCEAN OF CONSCIOUSNESS contains Life! All
Life has consciousness because it is ‘inside’ of this
OCEAN. Life is one of the many cells or points of
light, that are the infinite building blocks of
CONSCIOUSNESS.
NDM: Is there a way that you can know that you are this
divine consciousness for certain?
Brigitte:
You
either know it or you don’t. There is no ‘uncertain’ or
‘for certain’ about it.
NDM; Do you think someone should self evaluate their
experiences and come to conclusions based on their own
intuition and gnosis, or have someone objective like a
sat-guru also give their insight into this?
Brigitte:
No one else can evaluate your experiences, for
experiences are always subjective. You are the only one
who can analyze your experience and come to a conclusion
about it. Someone who has experienced a certain stage of
consciousness, can certainly give their insights to
others. Be it a sat-guru or not.
NDM:
What are your thoughts on the two theories of
enlightenment. The experiential school of
Patanjali's
yoga,
verses the knowledge school of Vedanta?
Brigitte:
The two are far apart.
I feel that the knowledge of Vedanta is a more direct
and personal approach to Realization and the Beyond.
The knowledge of Vedanta is more comprehensive, than
Patanjali yoga. Vedanta gives more freedom and more
possibilities for Self-Realization and for discovering
the Transcendent Beyond. Because the methods for doing
so, are not confined to only one path. Through the
knowledge of Vedanta, you can discover and try different
paths and then choose the path that best resonates with
your own Beingness
Patanjali yoga belongs to the realm of Mind. With the
Mind alone, you will eventually reach a dead end. The
Mind cannot take you beyond a certain point. The Mind
itself, cannot enter the Transcendent. Yes, it can
catapult you into altered states of consciousness, but
the Mind itself, cannot liberate you from the Wheel of
Life or to complete you as a spiritual Being. So, once
you have reached the end of Mind, you will then have to
find another path in order to continue to evolve to your
full potential as a spiritual Being.